Homosexuality

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domovoihappy
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Post by domovoihappy » Fri 9th Feb 2007

BlackOpal wrote:

Why is it so disturbing? If you are going by the bible, I read on this other debate (or maybe it was this one) some very interesting passages. The only things it says against homo***uality is when it is rape. I think God would accept any kind of love, isn't loving the number one rule?
And wouldn't it be more of a sin to change who you really are than to love who you love?

But then are you saying that God encourages love(physical) between a grown person and a young child if they both consent? Isn't that just another kind of love? Spread the love! Yes we should love everyone, but that doesn't mean we should be ***ually active with everyone.

And no, I don't think it's a sin to change yourself. I think part of serving God is denying your own passions and doing his will. The general public disagree with the idea that we shouldn't change ourselves. That's why so many people make New Years Revolutions.


Leviticus 18:22
Do not lie with a man as one lies
with a woman; that is detestable.

Romans 1:26,27
Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts.
Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones.
In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations
with women and were inflamed with lust for one another.
Men committed indecent acts with other men,
and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.

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BlackOpal
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Post by BlackOpal » Fri 9th Feb 2007

domovoihappy wrote:
BlackOpal wrote:

Why is it so disturbing? If you are going by the bible, I read on this other debate (or maybe it was this one) some very interesting passages. The only things it says against homo***uality is when it is rape. I think God would accept any kind of love, isn't loving the number one rule?
And wouldn't it be more of a sin to change who you really are than to love who you love?

But then are you saying that God encourages love(physical) between a grown person and a young child if they both consent? Isn't that just another kind of love? Spread the love! Yes we should love everyone, but that doesn't mean we should be ***ually active with everyone.

And no, I don't think it's a sin to change yourself. I think part of serving God is denying your own passions and doing his will. The general public disagree with the idea that we shouldn't change ourselves. That's why so many people make New Years Revolutions.


Leviticus 18:22
Do not lie with a man as one lies
with a woman; that is detestable.

Romans 1:26,27
Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts.
Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones.
In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations
with women and were inflamed with lust for one another.
Men committed indecent acts with other men,
and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.

Yes, but homo***ual love is more than physical. Love between a young person and an old, if it is actually love, can wait until the younger person is a little older. Men and women have s.ex just for se.x as often as homos.exuals.
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domovoihappy
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Post by domovoihappy » Fri 9th Feb 2007

Then what about polygamists? What if the love is sincere to each and every one of their spouses and the spouses love them back? Should adulterers be allowed to pursue their enjoyments without being snubbed by society? The line has to be drawn.

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Post by BlackOpal » Fri 9th Feb 2007

I think that Polygamists should be able to do what they wish if each of their partners agrees to it and sees nothing wrong to it. It isn't any of our buisness. I think adulters should have to wait until the child is twenty or so, so that the kid can really know if it is love.
The line for love, I don't think can be drawn. It's love, way back when White women weren't to love black men, Rich weren't to love the poor, and people still did. Love will always cross whatever lines you draw, it can't be helped, it should be accepted.
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domovoihappy
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Post by domovoihappy » Mon 12th Feb 2007

An example of how the "It doesn't affect you" argument holds no water. Nudists walking around my neighborhood would bother me. Maybe it's none of my business. Maybe it doesn't directly affect me, but it's one of those things I shouldn't be expected to put up with. I have a lot of dreams and ideas about how America could be bettered. That's why I've decided to go into Journalism. I don't think I should simply accept things as the way they are. I am an American. My vision is to see that things get better and yes, to worry about other people. To worry about the kind of country my children will be raised in. To be good citizens we can't just "get over" problems that must be faced. To be good citizens, we have to face them. I live in Massachusetts and hopefully we will have a vote on the issue of homo***ual marriages in 2008(I'll be 18! YES!.)

As to the adulterers....it has nothing to do with children turning 20. It has to do with cheating on your spouse...but I guess it's all right if it's in the name of love, eh?

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Post by BlackOpal » Mon 12th Feb 2007

An example of how the "It doesn't affect you" argument holds no water. Nudists walking around my neighborhood would bother me. Maybe it's none of my business. Maybe it doesn't directly affect me, but it's one of those things I shouldn't be expected to put up with.


People shouldn't have to stop loving who they want because somebody else has to 'put up' with it. Their love isn't about anybody else, why should they have to 'put up' with having to get rid of their love because somebody else doesn't want it to happen. If it doesn't directly affect you, than putting up with it doesn't take much effort, and it will save somebody else a lot of grief and heartache.

As to the adulterers....it has nothing to do with children turning 20. It has to do with cheating on your spouse...but I guess it's all right if it's in the name of love, eh?


I do think that they should break it off with their spouse before they move on, it isn't fair for the other person not to know about how the first person feels. If they don't love their spouse, they shouldn't be forced to stay with them, but they shouldn't do anything else without first completely going through their marriage and relationship and sorting everything else out.
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Post by Hanyou Kitty » Fri 16th Feb 2007

With all the talk you hear these days against *** people, (like *** being used as a negative. "I hate math, it's ***.") I am surprised and happy about how this debate is going. My points:
1) It could be something to do with a chemical imbalance in the brain. Maybe a boy was born with more estrogen than testosterone. It's not their fault, why should we hate them?
2) What's so bad about *** marriage? If two people love each other, what does it matter if they're the same *** or not? Is it hurting you? Which leads me to my next point...
3) Is it really hurting you in any way? I hear some people are homophobic because they are afraid somebody who *** will "come on to them" or something. The prospect is ridiculous. Would you walk up to some random <span style='font-size:5pt;line-height:100%'>(assuming you're a girl)</span> guy and "come on to him"? Homo***uals are just as human as you and I are. The only difference is ***ual preference.
In my opinion, homophobia is preposterous.
My main argument: How is it hurting you?
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Post by BlackOpal » Fri 16th Feb 2007

Is it really hurting you in any way? I hear some people are homophobic because they are afraid somebody who *** will "come on to them" or something. The prospect is ridiculous. Would you walk up to some random (assuming you're a girl) guy and "come on to him"? Homo***uals are just as human as you and I are. The only difference is ***ual preference.


I love that point. We have to accept that homo***uals have good taste. That's what I told my friend. She said "I'm fine with people who are ***, just don't touch me."
And I said "Give them some credit, they do have good taste."
Don't flatter yourself. They won't hit on you, you aren't that attractive.
Thanks to darvit and /b/for my signature. :D
And thanks Kagoma, for the awesome birthday present that is the C&H sprite!
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Post by inkweaver » Fri 16th Feb 2007

BlackOpal wrote:
Don't flatter yourself. They won't hit on you, you aren't that attractive.

this is true.
You're warned...
*cackles*

I EAT A/M SHIPPERS FOR BREAKFAST! MUAH HA HA!
AND LUNCH.
AND TEATIME.
AND SUPPER, DINNER, MIDNIGHT SNACK, ET CETERA.

they taste distgusting because of the false shipping that poisons their blood.

but it must be done.

And, no, I don't want another penguin! gosh...

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Post by TomRK1089 » Fri 23rd Feb 2007

Actually, there's a rather simple answer to the whole marriage thing: become French.

No, seriously. If the US marriage system was identical to the French, we wouldn't have this issue. In France, you have a civil marriage that's totally separate from any church marriage. So it totally separates church and state, rather than entangling them as Bush and the religious conservatives would like to.

Being an ELCA Lutheran, I'm pretty liberal on this as far as it goes for religion anyways.

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BlackOpal
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Post by BlackOpal » Fri 23rd Feb 2007

You can get a none-religious marriage here, can't you? It is hard to tell someone they can't be married religiously, if they believe in Christianity they might want to get married under God.
Though it makes sense doing it that way, people might want more.
Thanks to darvit and /b/for my signature. :D
And thanks Kagoma, for the awesome birthday present that is the C&H sprite!
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TomRK1089
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Post by TomRK1089 » Sat 24th Feb 2007

BlackOpal wrote: You can get a none-religious marriage here, can't you? It is hard to tell someone they can't be married religiously, if they believe in Christianity they might want to get married under God.
Though it makes sense doing it that way, people might want more.

Well, yes, you can. However the logic behind the proposed ban is based on religious dogma; hence the increased separation.

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Post by NinjAngel » Thu 1st Mar 2007

Well. I gotta say, I'm a fervent supporter of *** marriage. A guy friend of mine is as well.

Honestly, the label "***" came about for some unknown reason, and has become taboo in our society. Not many people really remember that it means "joyful" and "lively". (Note: I, too, hate the idea that it is used to express disapproval) It is a label, and society has placed far too many labels on different people in society, many of them becoming derrogative. If we just put labels aside, we are people. People have the right to love who they want, when they want, and, in most circumstance, how they want. I also believe in the idea that most people are bi***ual, with one tendency being prevolent over the other. I don't remember the name of the exact scale, but it is a 6 point scale, with 1 being straight, and 6 being homo***ual. Most people fall in the 2-5 range, with barely anyone being strictly one way or the other. Again, someone with a 2 on the scale can just as easly fall in love with someone of the same gender as someone rated a 5 can. Society is to blame for the corrupt view many of us have. Society is corrupt.

(Damn. Those philosophes we're learning about in World Civ are getting to my brain. XD Oh yeah. I also get to vote in 2008. I'll be 18 about a month before the elections.)
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TomRK1089
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Post by TomRK1089 » Thu 1st Mar 2007

Honestly, in modern society this shouldn't even be an issue. What happened to separation of church and state?

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Post by NinjAngel » Fri 2nd Mar 2007

TomRK1089 wrote: Honestly, in modern society this shouldn't even be an issue. What happened to separation of church and state?

My goodness. Pardon the slight pun, but AMEN! (is not religious)

Bringing religion into an issue in a government of a country that has no set religion--as well as freedom of religion--is slightly hypocritical. (Applies to America in my case) Also, I really don't see why the issue is such a big deal in the first place. It's probably something that is going to come to pass like other marriage issues have in the past.

<a href='http://www.outproud.org/survey/highlights2.html' target='_blank'>http://www.outproud.org/survey/highlights2.html</a>

Here's some information on not only the Kinsey Scale, but some other interesting info as well.
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